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GsiTurbo 2.0L 16V Turbo buildup ***DYNORUN 236WHP 255WTQ***

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Postby GsiTurbo » Tue Oct 16, 2007 2:52 am

Sorry for late replies guys.

I might add power steering to it, but that would be a few months from now.
And yes, some poeople may not agree with the Cosworth inspired wing, but that is their choice :) Its a shame none of the 'classic' Cosworths made it to this side of the pond (Ford Escort Cossie, Sierra Cossie)....

Update...well, rather none. The car is getting parked for the winter this Wed and I only did drive it a few times over the weekends for meet or cruise. The car is going up for sale before the next season starts, in either current state, of with tuning done. At this point I am much happier with driving slow, quiet and economical Lanos.

In essence, I am changing hobbies to this (actually this is exactly what I want to buy)

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Postby PrecisionBoost » Tue Oct 16, 2007 3:14 am

GsiTurbo wrote:The car is going up for sale before the next season starts, in either current state, of with tuning done. At this point I am much happier with driving slow, quiet and economical Lanos.


First off..... you never drive slow :p .

I sure hope you will consider holding off until the car is tuned and running/driving decent before making your final decision.

I still think we can adapt an electric PS booster to get rid of the nasty pulling over potholes.

I know you will allways be there for my "Kadette/Astra" projects but it won't be any fun if I don't have someone to race against.

You have to promise me that we will do one run at Castrol Raceway with the drag slicks I bought off RoRo's Aveo just to see how fast she is.

I'll even pay for the dyno time if we get Travis booked up for your car and my Mazdaspeed 3.
1994 Opel Calibra 4X4 turbo ( C20LET 2.0L 16V Turbo )
2002 Daewoo Lanos
2011 Mitsubishi Lancer Raliart --- SOLD! :)
1989 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) --- SOLD! :(
1990 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) ---SCRAP! :(
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Postby gse_turbo » Sat Oct 20, 2007 7:47 pm

so what ever came of the latest dyno run?

Tom i was also wondering, did you ever install those adj. cam gears?

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Postby gse_turbo » Sat Oct 20, 2007 7:57 pm

[quote="GsiTurbo"]
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quote]

after seeing this pic i kind of got the answer i expected, do you still have the second adj. gear or was it used on something else?

if you still have it do you want to sell it or are you still planning to mod it?

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Postby PrecisionBoost » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:51 pm

gse_turbo wrote:so what ever came of the latest dyno run?


There was a problem with fuel supply.... the adjustable fuel reg would actually start dropping in pressure under boost instead of gaining.

As Tom started to move into boost the A/F would start to rise very quickly despite the fact that we maxed out the Greddy injector map ( +50% )

I would have expected that he'd be removing fuel instead of adding fuel with his current injectors ( 48 lb/hr vs the stock 21 lb/hr )

Bascily it seemed as though the fuel system was limited to a particular output of fuel..... and no matter what we changed the A/F would not respond.

I will say that he was allready making some very nice torque numbers at 3000 RPM and 7psi of boost ... he was allready very close to the maximum tuned output of his previous C20GET engine.

We removed the adjustable fuel regulator and we were going to use the stock Astra VXR ( Z20LEH ) regulator from one of my fuel rails but we quickly found out that it was the same part number as the nubira fuel regulator. ( the VXR regulator was brand new so we used it.... but it was identical to the Nubira regulator so we didn't really need to put it in )

The adjustable fuel regulator didn't seem to be working exactly as I would expect (I was testing it at my shop yesterday) but it may not have been the only problem.

The other thought is that the Subird C20GET fuel pump didn't have enough flow to accomidate the power levels.

The C20GET fuel pump is a fairly old unit... it's possible it may have been part of the reason for the old C20GET failure... there is no way to know without testing it.

Luckily it just so happened I had a brand newWalbro fuel pump designed for a Cyclone/Typhoon/Buick Grand National which is capable of supporting massive power numbers.

It's basicly a drop in uprgrade for the Lemans/Astra chassis .... you just have to solder the Walbro connector to the stock connector.

We did a test run yesterday and the car seems to behaving better.... our friend said he'd be around the shop on Sunday so Tom might stop in and throw it on the dyno.

We've also been discussing some issues with regards to tuning the ECU with the Greedy during Closed loop..... so we are going to make some adjustments to the Wideband LC-1 to try and bring the target Lambda closer to 12:1 to keep the ECU from throwing in a bunch of short term fuel trim during low and mid range.

Basicly one of the LC-1 outputs is simulating the primary O2..... so it's just a matter of adjusting the output curve to match what we need it to be to make the ECU happier.

Hopefully things work out ok and Tom is able to make it to our friends shop tommorow, I haven't talked to him today so I don't know what he's up to right now (may be working on project Super Swift )
1994 Opel Calibra 4X4 turbo ( C20LET 2.0L 16V Turbo )
2002 Daewoo Lanos
2011 Mitsubishi Lancer Raliart --- SOLD! :)
1989 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) --- SOLD! :(
1990 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) ---SCRAP! :(
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Postby gse_turbo » Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:02 pm

hopefully the bugs get worked out and we see the big numbers that the motor is capible of.

you mentioned fuel pressure reg issues and i kind of anticipated that with my build. what i did was drilled and tapped the end of the fuel rail by the OE regulator and bypassed that unit all together. the motor is not 100% together yet but when it is i'll be running my regulator after the rail in the return line.

not sure if that would help n Toms setup but just a suggestion.

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Postby PrecisionBoost » Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:17 pm

that's basicly the setup he had before.... he was using an external fuel pressure regulator and the one on the rail was disconnected.

Given that the VXR engines have been pushed well into the 350hp plus range with the stock fuel rail and regulator I have to think that the stock VXR regulator setup should be fine for the power he's looking for.

Right now the F20 is the "fragile" part of this project...... the engine was waranteed by the builder of the bottom end (race engine building place) for 600whp .... so it's just a matter of how much he figures the F20 can take without self destructing.
1994 Opel Calibra 4X4 turbo ( C20LET 2.0L 16V Turbo )
2002 Daewoo Lanos
2011 Mitsubishi Lancer Raliart --- SOLD! :)
1989 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) --- SOLD! :(
1990 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) ---SCRAP! :(
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Postby gse_turbo » Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:21 pm

i'm drawing a blank right now but dont you do some type of machine work? is it worth having some custom hardened gears cut?

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Postby PrecisionBoost » Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:32 am

:) ya.... I mentioned that to Tom.... his response was.... well.... short

I wouldn't cut the gears myself.... there are a number of shops locally that will make custom gear sets.

Part of the problem is the input shaft size... it's pretty wimpy compared to the F28 and M32.... and I would imagine there might be issues with the strength of the case.

Most companies that set up the F16/F20/F28 for racing will shotpeen,nitrate,cryotreat and polish the gearset and blueprint everything to make sure the tolerances are really decent.

But the F20 in Tom's GSi is a completely stock used F20 from Sweeden..... if his F20 goes away I'm sure he will sell the car on the spot for whatever he figures is fair. (probably to me)

Hopefully it doesn't come to that.
1994 Opel Calibra 4X4 turbo ( C20LET 2.0L 16V Turbo )
2002 Daewoo Lanos
2011 Mitsubishi Lancer Raliart --- SOLD! :)
1989 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) --- SOLD! :(
1990 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) ---SCRAP! :(
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Postby GsiTurbo » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:02 am

gse_turbo - I 'might' have the 2nd QED camgear, altough there is chance I left it at the machine shop that was going to modify it. Since they moved, it went 'missing'. On the other hand, if its still in one of mine boxes, most certainly I will consider selling it.

As far as the Chris' comments go, yes, my answer into dumping any more money into the project is short - NO Hence, as a result, I will keep the power output on a 'safe' side, so the car actually does hold some value, as opposed being not drivable and worthless. I really do not want to replace the gearbox.
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Postby GsiTurbo » Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:44 am

gse_turbo => I cant seem to find the camgear..I'll keep looking :(

As far as the updates go, well, Chris and I spent good 4 hrs on a dyno Sunday night. And from the looks of it, we cannot push the car @approx 7-8psi past the 4500rpm line, still due to lack of fuel. We simply might have topped the 48lbs/hr injectors at 42psi fuel pressure. Unfortunately, I dont have any other fuel regulator at this point.

While I dont have any dyno runs, currently the car is making approx 215whp, and 244 wtq while the turbo spools up properly.
I dont believe there will be any further updates until the spring time.

Tom
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DYNO RESULTS: 238WHP 255WTQ

Postby GsiTurbo » Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:40 am

Well, that did not go into storage right away afterall. Chris and I spent another few hours tinkering with the fuel system. All the internal from the factory fuel regulator were removed, to prevent any function afterall. We did install an aftermarket FPR, with adjustable base pressure, as well as the raising rate....after numerous pulls, replacing spark plugs (once again, NGK V-Groove seem to work best), adjusting maps and getting the RPM signal to interace properly with the Dynojet software, we did perfect pull. I did not want to go all the way to the anticipated 8000rpm redline, as the motor has below 700 miles on it.

238 whp, and 255.5 wtq at 10psi of boost
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On the way back from our friend's shop, it felt really nice to see Mazdaspeed 3 fall behind... ;)

BIG THANKS TO CHRIS, TRAVIS@APEX and everyone else that helped with this project...and I apologize to be real pain at times...

Hopefully, a video from the dyno will be uploaded tommorow.

Tom
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Postby gse_turbo » Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:27 pm

VVEERRRYY NICE!

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Postby greenbluewoo » Fri Oct 26, 2007 6:56 pm

+1 great build
2.0 engine swap in the works
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Postby PrecisionBoost » Sat Oct 27, 2007 3:53 am

I think these numbers are absolutely amazing considering it's at 10psi of boost (electronicly controlled)

At this point anything above 10psi starts to become a risk... 255 ft-lb of torque on a stock F20 is definitly starting to push it's limits.

Odds are it would be just fine for dyno pulls at higher boost but I have to think that 10psi for street is perfect.


We had a bit of a "test" between the Gsi and my Mazdaspeed 3 and off a rolling start he pulls away very quickly ( 1.5 car lengths ) before I started to hold my distance.

Off a complete dead stop my LSD,equal length drive shafts and complex ECU that limits torque at each wheel based upon a dozen sensor made up for the difference in weight between our two cars.

I was able to keep up and actually had to let off at the top of 2nd gear (since I was behind him )

If the GSi had a limited slip and equal length drive shafts my MS3 would have no chance despite the fact that I'm making more torque down low (at a significantly higher boost than his)
1994 Opel Calibra 4X4 turbo ( C20LET 2.0L 16V Turbo )
2002 Daewoo Lanos
2011 Mitsubishi Lancer Raliart --- SOLD! :)
1989 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) --- SOLD! :(
1990 Passport Optima GSi (Astra MK2 ) ---SCRAP! :(
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